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Video Keywording

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Dragon
Posted Tue Dec 21, 2010 12:23PM

Hey Keith,


There seems to be a bit of confusion still so i am going to add some video examples.


Narrative Cinema - Are video files that are character driven and seem to be part of a bigger story. I had a look through your light box with the video team and about 10% would defiantly fit into the category of narrative cinema but not all. The first example that i came across in there was the video of Christlyn and I portraying an abusive relationship. The characters driving the scene being an abuser and victim, but also that the video itself appears to be only a part of the whole story. Hope this helps clarify this one a bit further.


Film composite - Here the term film is just describing that this term in particular is for moving image composites. Yes there is a term composite in the CV and we may look to merge the two terms in the future, but this term is the one that existed for moving images that getty had made before we merged the vocabulary with istock.


Moving Image Activity term - this again as i said above is what we call a parent term. A parent term is like a file folder that contains more specific terms in it. So moving image activity term may not be something a client searches by, it is a necessary term to allow us in meta data to group terms in a more organized manner. Using the terms below I would see being useful for clients. Like a file of someone sitting down, not just of someone in a seated position but the act of sitting down.


file_thumbview_approve


Tracking Shot & Scrolling - What you are describing is what i know as motion tracking and is a post production technique. an actual tracking shot is like this file below where the camera tracks the movement of the subject.


file_thumbview_approve


Scrolling is when the subject or subjects enter and exit the frame from one side to the other, either right to left, left to right, top to bottom ect. here is another example i found of a scrolling file.


file_thumbview_approve


 


Dutch Angle and Hand held - These are great terms i am going to add to the moving image section right away. I cant believe i even forgot about them LOL. Thankyou for bringing them up and reminding me that they are there. This is exactly what we had hoped for when we created this open dialog. To discuss other terms i might have missed or didn't know about and to clarify if things were a little confusing as we all start off on this new area together.


Bleach bypass - over all we think the term desaturated is more of a term people will use when looking for files of this nature. I will however take a look into mapping this term as a synonym of desaturated. That way people that do use this term get into searches that a client would be happy to see their files but not know about the term of bleached bypass.


Over all though for terms one might think are not searched by clients, from what i have found almost every keyword on our site has been used to conduct a search. My best example is I have found files with multiple downloads that the number one keyword used to find the image was descriptive color, not a specific color but the term descriptive color. Yes this still baffles me too as i haven't a clue what they were searching for but this search must have yielded a file they were interested in. So as a whole i say use the terms that are proper for your file and i wouldn't omit any by thinking it might never be found or searched that way, as you never know what a client is doing a search by and it wont hurt your file to have a term in there anyway.


-Chad
Dragon
Posted Tue Dec 21, 2010 1:02PM
I have added dutch angle shot and hand-held shot to the vocabulary, so keyword away as ducksandwich would say hehehe. I have also talked with some others here in meta data and we are going to create a new term for cinematographer (occupation) in the vocabulary and I am going to merge cinematography to it. We couldn't see anyone using this keyword unless they were searching for someone like yourselves who are cinematographers and that would be represented in the files itself. We also totally agree with you keith about the redundancy of having two terms in the vocabulary to denote composites. So we are currently working on merging and updating our CV with getty and it appears that they have already merged these two terms. I am going to keep a note here and wait till the CV gets updated to see if these terms merge together on their own, but if they don't i will merge them myself after the update.
benjikat
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Posted Tue Dec 21, 2010 4:01PM

Posted By Dragon:

Tracking Shot & Scrolling - What you are describing is what i know as motion tracking and is a post production technique. an actual tracking shot is like this file below where the camera tracks the movement of the subject.
file_thumbview_approve


That isn't a tracking shot - it's a pan following the subject. A tracking shot is where the camera is being moved around on wheels - otherwise known as a dolly shot. And wikipedia agrees with me: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tracking_shot

ETA - that "scrolling shot" is also a tracking or dolly shot in my book.

(Edited on 2010-12-21 16:03:03 by benjikat)
multifocus
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Posted Tue Dec 21, 2010 4:11PM
Yep, I have to agree with Ben. 15 years at the BBC (man and boy ), they told me that was a pan. I've got my trainee camera op notes in the roof somewhere...


Track and dolly, same thing....


EDIT: Found my notes.... just had doodles of naked girls on it so no help sorry. Let's take it that wiki knows best?


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tracking_shot

(Edited on 2010-12-22 02:33:00 by multifocus)
Dragon
Posted Wed Dec 22, 2010 7:21AM

Interesting I have worked on a number of Hollywood features and tv shows and they always referred to tracking shot as i did above. I talked to Jim yesterday and he confirmed it was, also checked AMC and a couple other places and they also refer to a tracking shot as a following shot.


"tracking shot- a smooth shot in which the camera moves alongside ('tracking within') the subject, usually mounted on a dolly, in a side-to-side motion (relative to the scene or the action); also known as following shot" Examples: from Eyes Wide Shut (1999) (pictured here); some other famous examples of tracking shots are examples of Steadicam 'tracking', including Danny's point of view (POV) shots in Stanley Kubrick's The Shining (1980), when wheeling around the Overlook Hotel"


I will how ever confer with jim and the other video guys and see what the consensus is as when i talked to him yesterday in regards to keiths questions he had confirmed that is what a tracking shot is, but hang tight till i can talk with him today. We will get this figured out one way or another.
vesperstock
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Posted Wed Dec 22, 2010 8:33AM

Posted By multifocus:
...Let's take it that wiki knows best?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tracking_shot


Wikipedia is written by ordinary people (like us) so it's not necessarily the gospel, although with citations it's usually pretty good. And it's always possible for ordinary people (like us) to update it.

re: tracking shots: on set, I use the term whenever the camera is on some kind of mobile platform. It may or may not follow the action, eg. you can track along with the action, but also track in or track out or dolly around a scene. Platforms include dollies (hence dolly shots), cars, steadicams, helicopters, sliders, etc.

What I'm trying to say, I guess, is that it's probably helpful to use the terms broadly so that buyers can search for what they believe a tracking shot or dolly shot should look like.
vcr
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Posted Wed Dec 22, 2010 8:45AM

I believe we are saying very close to the same things. i have always understood tracking to be a moving camera shot, traveling alongside and following a moving subject. Panning is following the action from a stationary point (pan means across) generally on a tripod and in the horizontal direction. 
vesperstock
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Posted Sun Jan 2, 2011 5:37PM

Posted By Dragon:
Tracking Shot & Scrolling - What you are describing is what i know as motion tracking and is a post production technique. an actual tracking shot is like this file below where the camera tracks the movement of the subject.

file_thumbview_approve



Took me a while to get back here (Christmas etc, you know). Anyway, I think I agree with much of this but that example above is definitely *not* what I'd describe as a tracking shot. It's a pan with a zoom in at the end to follow the action. The panning camera 'tracks' the movement of the bike but the camera isn't on any kind of moving platform that would allow it to physically move with the action.

In other words, what Jim and multifocus said.

===

Moving on, is the term "flicker" for a flickering video clip anywhere? I keep coming up with "Northern Flicker Bird" for clips where the light is supposed to be flickering in a fast strobing kind of way.
Dragon
Posted Mon Jan 3, 2011 7:06AM
We have the term of "blinking" in the CV map probably the best keyword for a light strobing effect.There is also "Flash" under lighting effect that might also fit the bill.

(Edited on 2011-01-03 07:07:59 by Dragon)
vesperstock
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Posted Mon Jan 3, 2011 9:44AM
I'm not sure either of those really describe what I'm getting at because it's not really the lighting on the subject, so much as the flickering of the clip itself. Think of flickering fire light, or flickering film. It's actually a flickering film effect that I'm trying to replicate and keyword.
Dragon
Posted Mon Jan 3, 2011 11:18AM
are you meaning flicker like an old style film? the flickering that naturally occurs in that medium. If so i think "film" would be the best to describe that, but i will talk with the video team and see if there is something that would describe that specific effect.
toddmedia
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Posted Sat Jan 15, 2011 10:09AM
I have a huge headache now from reading this thread. I feel all my clips are about to disappear and never be found.

A) Is there a master list of all these new film type terms I can reference while going back and re-keywording 900 video files I have going back nearly 5 years? I don't want them not being found because buyers get so very specific now in searches. Leaving off any applicable keywords from not realizing there is a new one added that buyers use ... can kill a file and make it invisible ... even though the buyer might have liked it IF he had seen it.

B) Is said list nearly complete ... or should I wait awhile before editing all these files? I'd rather not do it now if in 6 months a whole new round of 'movie and film terms' get added.
Sproetniek
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Posted Sun Jan 16, 2011 9:25PM

Chad wrote:


"Bleach bypass - over all we think the term desaturated is more of a term people will use..."


Chad, there is a difference between bleach bypass and just plain 'ol saturated - bleach bypass raises the contrast on a local and global scale for a totally different feel than just desaturating. A still with a bleach bypass treatment, in which you'll note that it is not so much desaturated as contrast applied selectively:


file_thumbview_approve


Bleach bypass as an effect is therefore an accepted cinematography term, and quite trendy at the moment. I would suggest you include both BP and desat in the CV.


And to be completely anal - Dutch angle? I always thought it was a Dutch tilt, which is an angled shot. Maybe the more experienced producers can chirp up here?


 
Dragon
Posted Mon Jan 17, 2011 8:35AM

Hey Edward,


No need to worry, we are just expanding the compositional terms to help clients find your videos better. We elaborated on this section to help clients narrow down larger searches and find your videos that best fit their projects. just an example is "business", it has 23,341 results for video. The client may not have something in mind other then they need a business video. By making a more complete technique list they could now refine their search to something that fits into the project. These terms are not meant to be searched alone but in conjunction with other terms. Meaning your video will still have its same placement in said searches that it did before. We are actually hoping as we move forward these terms should allow clients to find your videos even better.


Unfortunately providing a complete list would be lengthy, but almost any video compositional term should now exist in this area and i have also tried to add any possible synonym to those terms. try adding any terms to your video that you would think applies and if you don't seem to find a term you need, post in here and I will see what we can do to accommodate your need. Also if your having troubles keywording a certain file, feel free to site mail me and I can help you with the terms.


 


Hey jaco,


I had discussed the term "bleach bypass" with the video team and we had all decided it was better as a synonym of desaturated since it was the main quality of the given technique that would be appealing to the client. As not all bleach bypasses have a strong contrast effect we felt that adding desaturated and/or contrast depending on the specific video would be better for client searches. Hang tight though, I will discuss this again with the video team and see if having it separate will be as beneficial.


In regards to "dutch angle shot". It has a lot of different names for the same technique and all the different names I have included as synonyms. dutch tilt, dutch angle, canted angle, german angle, oblique angle all map to the same term so no matter which term is used it nets the same results.


And in regards to keiths query about "flickering film effect" I am working on that term now and should have it up shortly, please stay tunned


Hope this helps for now and I will return with what the video team and myself have decided on.


-Chad


 
Dragon
Posted Mon Jan 17, 2011 10:06AM

The term "flickering film effect" is now in the CV, keyword away! I have migrated videos over from the "northern flicker bird" as it was the only term mapped to flicker before.


I talked to the video team again jaco and we have decided to keep bleach bypass as a synonym to desaturated. I will try and explain how we came to this decision. Bleach Bypass as we know it is a processing technique for film shots in which the bleaching step in the chemical process is skipped. The resulting effect has a desaturated look and sometimes adds some contrasts as well. Since most of the files uploaded to the site are videos and not film, to achieve this effect they are mimicking similar results in post and not actually conducting that exact technique. Also because the effect does not necessarily produce a contrast effect having the descriptive terms separate will allow clients results better suited to what they are looking for.  This also allows your files that are not actually bleach bypassed films to be viewed by clients that would be happy with a file that is similar to, but not exactly a bleached bypass.


Hope this explains things a bit better.


-Chad
piccadillyCircus
Member is a Diamond contributor and has 12,500 - 99,999 Audio downloadsExclusive iStockphoto Audio Artist
Posted Thu Jun 9, 2011 5:58AM
Hi all
don't know if this is the right place to suggest a video themed keyword:

is it possible to add the keyword "Silent Movie" to our CV?
(meaning those kind of funny "Charlie Chaplin" styled old movies)
Dragon
Posted Fri Jun 10, 2011 1:08PM

Hey Lorenzo, Sorry it has taken me a day or so to respond, I needed to talk to the video and audio departments before proceeding. First off that is a great term to add to the moving image vocabulary (and I have done so under moving image style). However this forum and the subsequent terms are for the video files on istock only. I have talked to the audio team and they agree that none of the audio files should be using this term. So although I have created the term please refrain from using it and stick to the terms set forth in the audio vocabulary. Just like the fact we reserve these terms for video contributors, vise versa they should not be using the terms created for the audio vocabulary in their video files. If you have any questions or concerns all contacts to the audio team should go through the help ticket support system.


Thank you again though for the suggestion of the added term and for the videographers : Silent Movie (Moving Image Style) is now in the CV keyword away.


-Chad
piccadillyCircus
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Posted Mon Jun 13, 2011 9:38AM
Hi Chad
I'm very pleased you think my "Silent Movie" suggestion is useful to improve iStock's CV, and I'm very thankful you could add it. Also I noticed it's also translated from "silent cinema". I could add a little advice: in italian a silent movie is called "film muto" or "cinema muto" but typing those words doesn't work...it would be good also adding translations for different languages.

The thing I cannot agree is that this very useful word can't be used when keywording Audio.
Movies are not only moving images, that's a complex form of art which joins Video AND Audio together. A movie without its soundtrack (music & sfx) cannot be called that way, just like a soundtrack without its images. Try watching a movie without sound to see what I mean.
There are specific pieces of audio uploaded on this Site (both sfx & music) which are designed to work together with specific images/moving images styles. We audio folks DO use also non-musical words to describe our works and make it visible to buyers. I used for example the word "horseback riding" in a series I did some time ago, though there's no real horses sounds in it. That's a western-styled soundtrack, perfect fitting horseback chases scenes.
When people think about "Silent Movie" they see B/N retro images thru an old flickering projector, and they hear those typical funny ragtime out-of-tune piano music tracks. They are just made to work together.
In the same way I think it's allowed to use "rock and roll" in a Video keywording, when the Video is related to the "rock and roll" culture.
It just makes relevant files easier to find by buyers.
If a buyer would be looking for a silent movie styled piano, he/she would probably type in "silent movie music" or "silent movie piano"...I hardly think somebody would try with "funny ragtime piano solo" just because very few people know what "ragtime" means, while everybody knows what a "Silent Movie" is and how it should sound like.
Similarly, most of us Audio contributors do use some words that aren't strictly music-related. Just because our works are designed to fit (and work together) with specific Moving Images styles. I'm talking about time-lapse, slapstick comedy, show, musical theatre, sport, contest, war, technology, love, romance... and many others...if we should keyword using only musical vocabulary our tracks would be all tagged almost the same way, and buyers would get upset not being able to find some "silent movie music" or "horseback riding music"...

I don't know if this conversation can be kept into this specific thread...maybe it would fit better the audio forum, though I was interested in your response about this matter, Chad. Sorry if I answered in the wrong place
GreenPeasProductions
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Posted Sat Oct 15, 2011 8:35PM
Is there a running list of accepted keywords for "generic" clips? Or do these just need to be obvious keywords based on content? Sorry if this gets a little off track form this thread; thought it may be the best place to start. The last clips I uploaded were a couple years back; and went throught he proxy method. I'll be adding meta file on the HD clips I'm currently uploading. 
Dragon
Posted Mon Oct 17, 2011 11:01AM
/
/Hey David,


Not sure exactly what your asking, but for uploading video clips its best to include the generic terms that describe the facits of the video. Things like the format (HD, Pal, ect.) the camera technique (panning, lockdown, ect.) and the running time (10 seconds or lesss, 20 seconds or greater, ect.). After that keywording what is in the video clip and not using implied keywords is the best rule of thumb to follow. Hope this helps, but let me know if there is something with abit more detail you would like to know and i can do my best.


I have done alot of editing to the video section of the vocabulary so there should be alot more to fit the needs of all video contributors and clients. Let me know though if you notice something that could be added and we will look in to adding new terms to help adapt and grow this section.


-Chad

(Edited on 2011-10-17 11:04:01 by Dragon)
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